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马友友谈练琴的意义,看完受益终身!

马友友谈琴的意义


马友友



This seems to be fodder for a very important book on society.


问:这些素材如果写成一本书的话一定会在社会上引起很大反响的。



No, just musings of a middleaged person going through what everybody goes through. I’d like to be able to think about these things, but also be able to try and play in tune. But while I’m playing in tune, not to obsess over intonation, but the obsession of trying to play in tune because transcending technique allows me then to communicate the content.


马友友:不是的,这些只是一个中年人的沉思,而这些思考每个人都会经历。我希望自己可以思考这些事情,但也能演奏并且能拉得准。当我演奏的时候也不会去过度在意音准,但也不能完全不在意,因为只有越过了技术这道坎才能谈传达内容的问题。




Do you still practice a lot?


您现在依然会做很多练习吗?



I actually enjoy practicing more and more . . .   as a child, I practiced because I had to practice and you didn’t want to mess up. But that’s not a good thing. You want to please your teacher, you want to please your parents, you want to please your peers. And now I practice because I’ve experienced so much love that you practice out of loving a phrase, loving motivic change, loving a structure or harmony change or the way a sound can get to something.


实际上我越来越享受练习了……我小时候会练习,因为我不得不练琴,你也不会想去把事情搞砸。但那并不是太好的事情。你想让老师满意,让家长满意,也使同龄人对你心服口服。现在我是为了热爱而练习,会因为喜欢某一个乐句而练习,或者是因为喜欢主旋律的变化,喜爱某一种织体结构或者和声变化,抑或是因为某一种声音能够导向不同的东西。



I think that part of practicing is great because it unites what you want to do in engineering, as in technically, where do you put your arms and your fingers and your body—micro movements with that desire and the feeling of what it needs to be. That’s a wonderful process because it’s a constant of going toward something bigger than the notes and yourself, and very lovingly so.


我觉得练习的这部分很棒,因为这会结合一部分工程学的东西,从技术上来说,你如何放置你的手臂、手指和身体十分重要——细小的动作——身体的感觉心中也有数。这是一个妙不可言的过程,因为那些音符之外的东西会被打磨得越来越完善,离目标越来越近的同时,你自己也会随之而成长,这让人感觉非常亲切。



马友友



Whenever I catch myself playing something that sounds mechanical but dead, it’s because either I’m not paying attention or it’s something difficult that I haven’t solved. Sort of like a physicality issue that, you know, sudden tension, so I freeze up and become more internalized, so I can’t love it. Loving something implies going outside yourself and fear means retreating into yourself. I’m scared. Well, go back into yourself.


每当我发现自己演奏出来的声音很机械没有生命,要么就是因为我没有集中注意力,要不就是有一些困难的地方我还没有解决。这是物质层面的问题,你知道的,身体会突然紧张,所以我会突然从内而外地僵住,所以我没办法去爱它。爱一种事物意味着要从自我中脱离出来,而恐惧意味着缩回自我的躯壳中。我害怕。那你就回到自我中去吧。



That’s a metaphor for societal fears when a whole people are scared of something that they can’t control and sort of hits them, what do they do? It becomes more tight, they will make much, much more conservative decisions. The counteracting of that is culture. Hey, wait a minute, I want to know what that fear is. I’m going to research that fear.


这就好像社交恐惧症,一群人害怕一种他们不能掌控的事物,甚至让人大脑一片空白,他们会怎么做呢?当情况紧张起来的时候,他们就会作出更加保守的决定。这种碰撞我们称之为文化。等一下,我想知道那种恐惧是什么。我想去调查它。



What exactly is that fear? Is it exactly what I think it is? Is that what I feel or can I analyze it? What’s the truth behind the fear? So you kind of have to look at that that’s a key in performance. When someone performs, you want that person to be open and not to have any barriers. Any barriers that are set up between the performer and the audience actually impedes the communication of what needs to be.


那种恐惧到底是什么?是我想的那样吗?是我能感受或者分析的事物吗?恐惧背后的真相又是什么?所以你不得不去关注它——这是演奏中的关键之一。当一个人演奏的时候,你会希望他完全敞开心扉,不去设置任何障碍。任何演奏者和观众之间的障碍都会影响应有的交流。



马友友




I often tell people the world needs more Yo-Yo Mas, and this is a perfect example. Just these ideas alone, if people could hear them, everything that’s headed in the wrong direction can turn around.


我经常说这个世界需要更多的马友友出现,这就是最好的证明。如果人们能听到这些想法,所有误入歧途的事情都会被扭转。



I don’t know. We’re so invested in thinking, in trying not to screw up. Basically, I have your back. We don’t want to make obvious mistakes, so we cover up. But actually, to really create trust, you have to trust that it’s OK to make a mistake, and you’re not going to be punished for it. We acknowledge and do better the next time. It’s one of the hardest things to do because we don’t want to look like fools.


我不知道。我们花了太多时间去思考,只是为了不把事情弄糟。比如说,我支持你。因为我们并不想犯很低级的错误,所以我们会掩盖事实。事实上,如果想建立真正的信任,你就要相信犯错并没什么大不了,你也不会因为这个而受惩罚。我们吸取了经验教训,下次就会做得更好。这是最难做到的事情之一,因为我们都不想看起来像傻瓜一样。



[New York Times writer] David Brooks has been talking lately about what we work for: our CVs or do we work for our eulogies? There are different things that you work for, curriculum vitae, and people talk about a person differently in the eulogy. There you talk more about character—this and that—and so which one are we working for? That’s a kind of philosophical question, isn’t it?


David Brooks(纽约时报作家)最近谈到我们为什么而努力:为了我们的简历还是为了他人对你的评价呢?有很多你可以为之努力的事情,简历,或者是别人如何去评价你。你可能会想到人的品性——各种不同的性格特征——所以我们到底是为了什么在努力呢?



That comes with a philosophical part of culture. What are we as a society working toward? So what are we working for in a community, what are we working for in a political party, what are we working for in classical music?


这有点像哲学问题,不是吗?这就和文化的哲学部分有关了。当社会不断向前发展的时候,我们的角色又是什么呢?我们在一个群体中,或是一个政党里为了什么而努力,在古典音乐中我们的努力方向又是什么呢?



马友友



You’re about to perform the Elgar Concerto, and have done so many times. How much time must you devote to it at this point?


您即将演奏埃尔加的大提琴协奏曲,而您已经表演这首曲子很多次了。这个时候您会在这上面花多少时间呢?



The thing is, you know, there is engineering, neuromuscular finger work, and there’s head work. So for anybody who’s really really passionate, basically it’s whatever it takes and it’s also head work. It’s kind of all the time. It’s sort of like you’re downloading a program in your computer, it’s in your brain.


你知道,练习的时候会关系到工程学原理,手指的神经肌肉运动,同时大脑也要运转。所以对那些对自己所做的事有极大热情的人来说,需要付出自己的全部才能将事情做好,大脑的思考也少不了。这个过程会一直持续不间断。就好像你在电脑上下载一个程序,而这个东西在你的大脑里。



When I go on to do the Elgar, I start thinking about it, on and off, all the time. So I’m thinking, “Huh, how about trying it this way?” So you’re always in some ways trying to hear something a certain way, solving a problem a certain way, and rethinking it and thinking there’s a better way to build this mousetrap. So you want to align your physical self and your mental self into the state of mind that is required of that piece.


我开始演奏埃尔加的时候,也会开始一刻不停地思考,思考各个方面的细节。所以我会想,“唔,试试这种方式怎么样?”,所以你总会开发理解同一事物的不同方式,用一种方式解决问题,然后重新去思考这个问题,想想会不会有更好的解决问题的方法。所以你会把自己调动起来,无论是肉体还是精神,把它调动到那首作品所需要的状态。



马友友



Do you ever envision your life after cello?


您想象过不演奏大提琴之后的人生吗?



Like après-ski, hot chocolate by the fireplace, with pizza?


就像滑完雪之后,在火炉旁就着披萨喝热巧?



You’re not going to lose any weight like that.


吃这个可不会让体重下降。



You’re right. Maybe a cup of herbal tea and some nuts. Well, I’ve always been interested in people and culture and arts and sciences and philosophy and typology, so I think I’m always going to be thinking about it, and the older I get, the more I’ll get interested in young people because that’s another form of culture.


你说得没错。也许再来一杯花草茶和一点坚果。我一直对人对文化对艺术科学哲学还有象征主义很感兴趣,所以我觉得我会一直思考这些事情,随着我年龄逐渐变大,我对年轻人的兴趣也会渐渐增长,因为那也是文化的另一种表现形式。



The young people’s world—we may occupy the same space, but they will think differently and have many different reasons to do what they do and I’m deeply curious about that. I like to think of it in K through 12 and beyond and how people learn—why they learn—and so I will always be thinking about these things.


年轻人的世界。我们可能共享同一个空间,但是我们思考的方式不同,做事情的原因也不一样,我对这些东西十分好奇。我会像将k和12对等一样思考它们,还有这些以外的其他事物,比如说人们是如何学习的,他们为什么学习?正是因为这些,我会一直思考这些问题的。



马友友



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